Inclusion That Actually Sticks

In this episode, Joanne Lockwood speaks with leadership advisor Susan Drumm about what it takes to make inclusion truly stick inside organisations. The conversation focuses on blind spots, patterns of thinking, and the way leaders can widen perspective through curiosity rather than resistance.

Susan explains how tools such as the Enneagram can help teams understand differing motivations, balance cognitive diversity, and make better decisions. She also explores the role of language, psychological safety, and voice equity in helping people speak up and engage more openly across differences.

The discussion moves into the impact of music, neuroscience, and self-awareness on shifting beliefs and rewiring unhelpful patterns. Susan shares examples of how people can recognise limiting narratives, reframe them, and create more empowering habits at work and in life.

The episode closes with reflections on leadership, authenticity, AI bias, and the importance of staying grounded in one’s own judgement while remaining open to others. Overall, it is a practical and reflective conversation about inclusive leadership, team dynamics, and long-lasting culture change.