--- title: "Resilience Through Reinvention" episode: 199 date: 2026-03-05 guest: "Bobbi Barrington" canonical: https://inclusionbites.co.uk/podcast/199-resilience-through-reinvention audio: https://cdn.seech.uk/podcast/episodes/ibs-199/audio.mp3 --- # Resilience Through Reinvention Joanne Lockwood is joined by wisdom speaker and coach Bobbi Barrington for a candid conversation about resilience, reinvention, and the cost of living an inauthentic life. Bobbi shares her lived experience of transitioning later in life and the profound changes that followed—losses alongside new freedom, joy, and a renewed sense of possibility. Together they explore how self-trust is built, how fear and grief show up during major life shifts, and why emotional intelligence and emotional vocabulary can be a gateway to healthier relationships and stronger communities. They also discuss practical realities that come with being a trans woman, including navigating healthcare, self-acceptance, and moments of doubt, alongside the power of supportive women’s spaces and connection. The episode leaves listeners with an invitation to challenge limiting beliefs, “tell a better story,” and choose a life that is truly their own. ## Chapters - 00:00 — Inclusion Bites: Spark Bold Change - 05:37 — Sharing Truth and Personal Growth - 08:29 — Becoming the Woman I Am - 12:33 — Reflections on Identity and Trauma - 13:29 — Embracing Feminine Identity Journey - 17:11 — Emotional Growth and Transition - 22:41 — Living Authentically, Embracing Self - 24:52 — Discovering the Real Me - 29:23 — Self-Acceptance as Trans Woman - 31:39 — From Doubt to Purpose - 35:53 — Challenging Filters and Perspectives - 38:56 — Unexpected Help and Insights - 43:45 — Reflections on Freedom and Identity - 44:44 — Navigating Trans Identity Challenges - 48:24 — Writing Your Own Storey - 54:22 — Inclusion Bites: Join Us - 55:13 — Fostering Inclusion, One Bite ## Key takeaways - How incremental steps and crucial moments spark transformational change and open new possibilities. - The role of emotional intelligence in personal growth, resilience, and overcoming self-doubt. - Navigating the complexities of societal expectations and the ongoing pursuit of radical authenticity. - Embracing discomfort as a catalyst for growth, self-discovery, and thriving beyond setbacks. - Practical strategies for rewriting internal narratives and releasing limiting beliefs that hold people back. - The importance of supportive communities and mentorship when reinventing identity or life direction. - Ways to design a fulfilling life regardless of age or circumstance, focusing on aliveness, potential, and continued self-exploration. ## FAQs ### Who is the guest in this episode and what is her background? The guest is Bobby Barrington, a wisdom speaker and coach based in Queensland, Australia. She specialises in personal reinvention, emotional intelligence, and building inclusive spaces where authenticity thrives. Bobby is also a trans woman who transitioned later in life and now champions self-discovery, personal growth, and radical authenticity. --- ### What is the main focus of this episode? This episode explores the theme of resilience through the process of personal reinvention. Bobby and Joanne Lockwood discuss navigating significant life changes, the intersection of gender identity and authenticity, and how embracing change can unlock new possibilities and emotional strength. --- ### How does Bobby define her ‘superpower’? Bobby describes her superpower as “transformation through truth”—the ability to turn fear into fuel and pain into power. Her personal journey exemplifies the empowerment found in owning one’s story and using it to inspire and support others towards positive change. --- ### What are some challenges Bobby faced when coming out as a trans woman? Bobby discusses the complexity of coming out in her sixties, having been previously married, and the difficulty of sharing her true self with her family. She highlights the loss of family connections and the necessity of self-acceptance, while underscoring the importance of courage and perseverance during painful transitions. --- ### Did Bobby always know she was trans? Unlike many, Bobby did not recognise her identity as a trans woman until her late forties. She did not have visible role models or community and only began to understand her truth gradually, through introspection over a decade and with support from a counsellor. --- ### What role does emotional intelligence play in reinvention? Emotional intelligence is central to Bobby’s journey. She notes the contrast between her earlier, emotionally suppressed life and her current existence surrounded by emotionally articulate women. Emotional intelligence has been key in learning to process feelings, make empowered choices, and support others through coaching. --- ## Transcript Bobbi Barrington: Foreign. Joanne Lockwood: Welcome to Inclusion Bites, your sanctuary for bold conversations that spark change. I'm Joanne Lockwood, your guide on this journey of exploration into the heart of inclusion, belonging and societal transformation. Ever wondered what it truly takes to create a world? Remember, everyone not only belongs, but thrives. You're not alone. Join me as we uncover the unseen, challenge the status quo and share storeys that resonate deep within. Ready to dive in? Whether you're sipping your morning coffee or winding down after a long day, let's connect, reflect and inspire action together. Don't forget, you can be part of the conversation too. Reach out to jo.lockwood@seechangehappen.co.uk to share your insights or to join me on the show. So adjust your earbuds and settle in. It's time to ignite the spark of inclusion with Inclusion Bites. And today is episode 199 with the title Resilience Through Reinvention. And I have the absolute honour and privilege to welcome Bobbi Barrington. Bobbi is a wisdom speaker and coach who champions personal reinvention, emotional intelligence and building inclusive spaces where authenticity thrives. When I asked Bobbi to describe her superpower, she said that his transformation through truth, she's able to turn fear into fuel and pain into power. Hello, Bobbi, welcome to the show. Hey, Joanne, what a delight to Bobbi Barrington: meet you again. It's a year since we met in London. We did. We had lunch at the Union Jet Club just by Waterloo Station. And Joanne Lockwood: yeah, it was fascinating to meet you because you were on a bit of a tour of the UK to sort out some legacy, legal and asset realisation, I believe, at the time. And, yeah, I. Well, I had months or so. I had a house to sell in the uk, Bobbi Barrington: which. Which subsequently done. But I was also. I met you through the PSA in London, you know, the Professional Speakers association, as a speaker myself, you know, so. And I'd been in France and I went to the French version of the psa. I'd also been to the Olympics and was travelling alone through Europe, through the UK and having a wonderful time. It was just the best time and I was so happy. Now I'm back in Australia. I'm on the Sunshine coast in Queensland in the Sunshine State and in a thunderstorm. In a thunderstorm. Well, it's. Well, it is like 8:30 now. PM. Yeah. Joanne Lockwood: So you had sun during the day and you got rain at night? Well, that's Bobbi Barrington: right. You know, it's quite warm, 30 odd degrees here at the moment and quite humid, so it's not for everyone. Joanne Lockwood: But I love it do you get real impressive fork lightning and big, big lightning bolts too. Well, I guess Bobbi Barrington: so. Last night they were like above the cloud, so I didn't really see that. But what I am seeing though is, and your listeners will love this is a few snakes, bunch of cane toads. I saw a foot long praying mantis the other day. Wow, Joanne Lockwood: that's. It's like a sci fi movie. They could eat your dog, couldn't it? Bobbi Barrington: It was just huge, you know, so there are the odd insects here, but mostly it's. It's pretty good. I've seen some videos on Facebook around Joanne Lockwood: praying mantises eating anything, you know, they're quite formidable predators, aren't they? Bobbi Barrington: I wouldn't really know. I. I removed it to a safe place and they let it carry on its life somewhere else. Joanne Lockwood: Okay. Yeah, yeah. You don't want to put your foot in its way or something. Yeah. It's not nibbling your toes off. No, no. So you're back in Oz, you're based in Brisbane now and you're a speaker and a coach. Bobbi Barrington: So I'm an hour and a half north of Brisbane. I'm on the coast and I'm a professional speaker, a motivational speaker. I'm a coach. I am about to start creating events. Well, I've created a few small events this year, but you know, mostly, mostly what lights me up is helping people to see new possibilities where previously they couldn't. This is a reflection of my own transformation and four, just four years ago. So I, I am a trans woman and I have changed everything. I have changed my body, I've changed my whole life. I've changed. I've moved interstate, you know, just moved into a new house. Everything is absolutely new for me. And I am 66 years old now and I have never been younger, happier. I'm working on getting fitter, having just started playing pickleball, which is a lot of fun. And I now as a single woman, I am divorced. I've lost my family, I've lost my marriage, I've lost dreams that I once had. But I am so free and so happy with who I have become and building trust in myself. And I was on a speaking trip around Australia, going from community to community speaking, going in front of audiences and sharing my truth, sharing my messages, sharing my wisdom. And this was not the me that I used to be. You know, I used to be shy and introverted and not want to stand out or attract attention. And now here I am, six foot tall with purple hair and I stand in front of people. And I speak. And I speak because I think what I have to say is important. And I think that, you know, like, my message isn't about gender, but my gender is part of the storey, part of my storey to my womanhood. And everybody has their own storey. And one storey is not better than another. Just our storeys. And this just happens to me, mine. What choice have I got to run with it? You know, I'm a woman. So doing a bit of mathematics, from what you just said, Joanne Lockwood: this all occurred 4.4and a bit years ago. So that would have been 60, 61 years old. Bobbi Barrington: Yeah. 60. Yeah. Yeah. See, that must have been a Joanne Lockwood: lot of soul searching, a lot of thinking about this, that what was the moment you realised that this was necessary for you? So Bobbi Barrington: unlike others that I read about and people that I know who have children who have known when they were 2 or 5 or 11 or something like that, it wasn't me. It wasn't until I was like my late 40s that I just started feeling differently about myself and my body. But I didn't know any trans people. I didn't. It hadn't been. I hadn't met anyone until, even until I was on the journey, you know, and until. Until I was really at the point of starting to, you know, get proper medical attention. That was the first time I started meeting trans people. So it was not part of my life at all. It was something intern me that happened gradually, over a decade or so, and it was like little steps, little steps, little steps, little steps of feeling. But during that time, I didn't have any kind of sense that this was the reality that I would create. One of the things I speak about is creating your own destiny, creating your own reality. And there are many facets to that. Much of it is mental, you know, and. And you, you know, like by creating your own reality through changing your beliefs and changing your attitudes and the way that you show up in the world. But part of it is actually the physical. Creating the physical reality of myself, you know, and I had. I had no sense that this would be my reality. And there was a point, I think a point where it was really started to become a possibility was when I saw a counsellor who parted a curtain for me and let me see a vision of who I could become. And I had this form, this dream of a woman on the beach in a swimsuit, hair fall down, falling down her shoulders, you know, just as a woman I was meant to be. But that was such a scary vision. That was like, oh, my God. Stepping out into public. And I remember I didn't want to be one of these women who looked like a man, you know, and you know how when men have long hair and it's all messy and looks like a guy with long hair, you know, and that was my vision. I don't want that either, you know, and it's not that now. But there was a transformational week. There was one week when everything shifted and it was the week that I saw the counsellor, I saw a psychiatrist, I got the sign off to hormones end and suddenly I could go into the women's section and have permission to shop in the women's section because I knew that was now my pathway. I didn't know what the path looked like, you know, like from the years from then on. But that was really a turning point. Were you married? Were you still Joanne Lockwood: married at this point? I was. So that. That must have been a. A tricky time, having been through this myself. It was a horrible time's an understatement. It was a horrible time. Bobbi Barrington: It was the worst time, you know, like. And not. And not, you know, the gender for me was. So I lived in the UK for a long time. I lived in London for like 25 years and came back to Australia in 2013 and everything fell to bits and it was so difficult. The gender stuff was like an extra thing to cope with, like our marital relationships, the money situation, trying to be a good parent and caring for my children. And it was just such a difficult time and one of the hardest times of my life. And I didn't know how tell my family about the gender side of things. And they were like the last people I told. I just didn't know how to. How to say that until the end. And I left and I moved interstate and I went and cared for my mum, who was. Who had got dementia by then. And that was during COVID So I spent a couple of years during COVID living in our family home and she was in care. And then in due course she passed away in 2022. And that was when I left South Australia, Adelaide, where I was, and moved to Brisbane, you know, to start a new life in a new body in a new part of the world. There's such a growth, such personal growth to do this. So now I'm a coach and I coach people through change. I coach people in terms of finding new possibilities at any point through a decision, navigating our way through the pain and the emotions and the grief of moving away from what was and embracing what can Be. And when you Joanne Lockwood: look back your life, are there. Are there moments in time, you know, going back, you know, 66 years old, going back over the last 50. 60, 70. Well, 66 years old. Are there times you look back and think, actually, that was a sign? Or, or is it. Was it a complete epiphany when it came, when it hit you, or was there signs? You asked me this question last year, actually, and Bobbi Barrington: because, because you felt, I think you were a little astonished that I. I didn't know until so much later. But looking back in retrospect. Absolutely, there are clues. There are clues about my femininity, about how I held myself, about how I, you know, like there were parts of my personality that were conditioned, you know, through my, you know, my father was an alcoholic and growing up, it was an emotionally, you know, challenging, difficult household. And I kept myself safe by protecting myself, by not standing out, not sticking my head out, you know, people pleasing those things. And. So that thread was running through my life until now, but also the gender side, you know, like, I look back now and I, and I, and I even look at my figure, my figure has always been feminine. And in the past, it was stuff that I got criticised for, you know, like childbearing hips, got that, you know, like pinhead pigeon chest. You know, these are like slights that people had directed at me through my life, which now have become assets to me, you know, because they create the physical, the feminine body that I have, you know. And I remember when I was in the. I was in the army in my early 20s, and we would go. I could go and buy secondhand jungle greens from the disposal stores, and I remember buying a pair that had been a woman's. And because the, you know, the, the waist seam had been tapered in, you know, I remember really liking that, you know, but. But looking back in those days, you know, you go to parties, you wear fishnets or something like that, you know, guys do that stuff too. So actually drawing the line between what is, you know, just a fun thing for a guy or one or something that has more meaning. Meaning for me. Hard to differentiate. But, you know, just. Just looking back at my life, I can see lots of clues, you know, but I had no role models, no examples, and I just accepted who I was for, you know, most of my life. What sort of things have. Have positively surprised you in Joanne Lockwood: the last six years or even the last six months? What surprised you about embracing this new you? Women. Women are Bobbi Barrington: extraordinary. I love my girlfriends. I love. I'll tell you what, like So I spent like 60 years as a man and now six years as a woman. Right? And so that 60 years of living with a man's emotional, you know, the, the way men handle emotions traditionally, you know, like and, and bottle it up and suppress it and pretend it doesn't exist, you know, apparently, apparently most people can only name three emotions. They're happy, sad and pissed off, you know, but, but, and, and in with my friends, we never would talk about emotions. We would never have used the vocabulary, the emotional vocabulary, you know. And now in my life, I am surrounded with women who are evolved in their emotional intelligence and their maturity. And in these circles and in these containers, we can talk about emotions without shame or judgement or being made wrong or anything like that. And it's so healthy, is so healthy, and it has helped me grow so much because the journey of going from where we are to where we want to go is a journey of the emotions. Because it's like fear of the unknown, anxiety. Like, I used to catastrophize about, like, everything in my life. I would make up futures that frightened me and I'd made them up, you know, but the fright was an emotional thing, you know, And I've had this scarcity mindset all my life and it's never because I've not had stuff or resources. It's because I feared not having stuff. And it's an emotion. The emotions is the most important thing. And the thing about my transition is that I have become a person who is emotionally intelligent, has personal power, has a capacity to respond rather than react, has so much strength. And it's not through transitioning, but it's. Transitioning gave me access to a world of women where we can talk about emotions. And in a time of, like, gender violence, there's a lot of gender violence going on around the world in Australia. It's like a big problem also. And I feel I have something to say about that to men, about being more emotionally vulnerable, because it is a conditioned thing, you know, is not innate to men or women. And me, you know, I am the example of what is possible when you change the culture, when you change the environment, when you change, you know, the beliefs and expectations within which I live. It's extraordinary, you know, like I. It's interesting. Joanne Lockwood: It's interesting when you talked about emotional intelligence that how, just to paraphrase what you're saying, I believe what you're saying was you've become more in tune with your own emotional intelligence since than you ever had in your previous life. 100%, a million percent. Bobbi Barrington: Like it's off the scale, you know, like, like I have grown so much, you know, and it's not just because, it's also because as a coach, I've also been in this world, you know, I have qualifications in NLP and you know, hypnotherapy and timeline therapy and things like that, you know, so. So I've been immersed in this world of personal growth and human design actually has been, you know, quite interesting for me as well. But, but like this me at 66 who is starting all over again. I lost a tonne of money, I'm having to rent. I wouldn't have, I would have needed to rent. But you know, like, this is where I am, you know, and I'm a single woman and I'm starting again in a new life and it's possible, you know, like other people are retiring at my age. I'm just beginning. And it's so exciting, you know, like this new world, this aliveness, this fun, this playful me, you know, not because of stuff outside of me, but because of the self trust and the growth that I've created within me. Yeah. And like my transition was the gateway to all of this. All of this. Yeah. It's just. What scares you? Dying unfulfilled. So what does fulfilment look like? Well, this is a very good question. Yeah. You know, like, and this is actually something that's come up for me in, you know, recent, recent days really actually about. About what drives me, you know, like, and I've wanted, I've always wanted to be worthy and to matter and attaching results to mattering. You see what, see what I mean? And it's just been a new growth for me to let go of me mattering because I already matter. And my message mattering. My message is what's important. My message of possibility, my message of you can reinvent your life at any point with a decision. My message that the realities that you live under may not be your truth, it might be someone else's storey that you're living. And that is what I do as a coach. I question, I ask clever questions. I help to shift beliefs. I help to. I help to show people, help people see what they can't see for themselves. To unlock the grip on a reality that may not be a truth. And little by little, finger by finger, there you go. Maybe it's not the truth after all. Maybe there's another truth that serves me better. Joanne Lockwood: Because when you're at that point where you're gonna metaphorically push a button because you can't unsay I'm, by the way, I'm trans. You've kind of said it, you kind of, it's a very binary switch. You tell people what was going through your mind at that point. You know, you, you've obviously been thinking about this for at least a couple of years at this time. You've obviously been for a test drive. You've been for. You start thinking about it, you've sat down with people who you love or you've sat down with people who you have mutual respect for and you have to share this news. What's the fear going through your mind at that point? So my biggest fear was with Bobbi Barrington: my sister and my brother in law because they, their relationship to me mattered the most. And absolutely there were fears. But also for me it was like a no brainer, it was a done deal, you know, like fear or no fear. It was something that was happening. And at that point I was on the journey, I was on hormones and you know, like electrolysis and stuff like that. You know, there was a whole project plan in place at that point. Yeah. And then I, I just, I just went for it. I posted on Facebook and said, you know, this will surprise people, but I'm actually a woman and important ways always have been. And nobody saw that, you know, but, but at the same time they hadn't seen the sadness that I'd lived for such a long time, you know, the fright that I'd lived under for such a long time, you know, and they, you know, I've just been writing a, you know, a webpage today about this, you know, about the living, living a life of less than. Living a life of settling for not good enough, living a life of inauthenticity. And at what cost? You know, like the cost to not just me, but the cost to the people who get affected by me now. Like this me who shows up as an authentic, happy look, the way I impact the world now is like a million times more, more powerful, important than the way I used to impact the world. The cost, you know, and I think about the, the cost to me, the cost to my family, my community of me being inauthentic versus the benefit of me being excited and happy and lit up and sharing that with the world with my energy and my words and my messages like you do, you know, like you speak, you know, like you are an important person, you know, who has messages to share, you know, like, and the cost of you suppressing yourself, like, how can we calculate that? But it's not about gender. It's about everybody who settles for a version of themselves that is less than, that is mediocre, that is less than the fullest expression of who they are. I think I can't. So there's hardly anything more important than encouraging others should they wish to become the fullest version of who they're meant to be, for themselves, for their family, for their communities, for the world, showing them. I think I look back Joanne Lockwood: on my life and I was never unhappy. I was never. Most people would say I was living life to the full. I was certainly Kurt Cobain said, if you're not living life on the edge, you're taking up too much room. So I was definitely the life and soul of my world, often the one that people used to frown at and tut at, because I was probably a bit too partyish and a bit too outrageous and a bit too, bit too me. I thought I was Max. I think what happened when I gender transitioned, I recalibrated the ceiling. I realised there's actually 20% of me that I never knew and I grew into that. So I've gone from being having a great life to having a better life or a better unconstrained life. And it's a lot of the traits I used to have, the outrageousness and the partying, all those things have fallen by the wayside. So I think what I was trying to do was I was in the search for something more and I could never find it. And now the transitioning was the thing that unlocked that attic room in my house of living and said, look, you've got all this extra space, you don't need that stuff in the basement anymore. Amazing. On my website I put Bobbi Barrington: opening minds, unlocking potential, and that's kind of what you're describing. But I also feel that that is the reality for most people. I feel that there is so much potential to unlock, but it's constrained by limiting beliefs and judgement and other people's opinions and shame and storeys, you know, the storeys and worldviews that we believe. And that's my job, you know, just to shine light, open, you know, unlock that hand a little bit, you know, And I'm sort of like. Joanne Lockwood: Many, many women who are probably in their 50s, early 60s, who have discovered that they're ready for a second life. They've done family, the children are grown up, the career, they don't want to go back to that old job in a company somewhere, and they want to find their best life. So I think it's not, it's not just us as gender diverse trans people. Yeah. As you say, other people, women say. I've had an. I don't want to just go back to being mum or this. My time is now. I am just releasing something Bobbi Barrington: through my website or, you know, through. And if people want to DM me, then it's called how to Feel Alive Again. And it's a, it's a, it's a short course and, you know, series of questions on feeling alive Again. You know, it's a guided process. So if people want to message me about that and I can get the link over. Amazing. Feel alive. One of my highest values is aliveness. I love it in people, you know, when the lights are on and lit up because they're excited, you know, and life should be exciting. Not a burden, not an ordeal. Yeah. Joanne Lockwood: Stuff that we talked earlier. I don't know if we talked earlier in the green room. We talked earlier when we were recording, but we talked about this, this box that we're living in. And society wants to constrain us by giving us labels and definitions. And the close we get to the edges of those labels and definitions, people want to shut us back into the box. Stop that. You're not allowed to do that. You're not allowed to do that. You've got to be one of these in this box. Everybody feels that pressure at some point. You talked about this, this being embracing radical authenticity, that authenticity of realising that box is a constraint. And it's not like you got a puppy and you need to put it. You need to put yourself in a crate every night. This is the thing that's holding you back. It's knowing how to get out of that. Well, we can't see what we Bobbi Barrington: can't see. And this is why coaches are so important in our world. People who can shine lights on beliefs and behaviours and habits that you don't even notice that you're doing. And like, just because you are a coach doesn't mean you can see any better than anyone else. So my, my transformation, I, I tell you what really happened. I had transitioned and I was in the process of transitioning in my gender and it has been. Been a journey. And I used to say that I'd had two transitions. One was my gender and one was my mindset and that the gender was the easy one and it was all done and dusted. I've recently discovered that it's not been quite as cut and dried as that because I've had a few self acceptance issues. Come up to do with my new life vis a vis sex as a woman. This is a new pathway, a new discovery for me. And touting myself as a trans woman vis a vis sex and inviting judgement and criticism, you know, that that was an edge for me. That was a big edge. And by and large I have been surprised and happy with the response that I've had to that. And you know, there are these guys in my life who I thought would run away and haven't. So that is amazing, you know, but my other transition is the mindset transition in. When I came back to Australia in 2013, I spent six years, those six very unhappy years, trying to. Trying to make money, build businesses, by and large, not very successfully. And then I left my family, I moved interstate and I tried to run some different kinds of businesses. Again, not very successfully. Just didn't know how to solve my problem. And so I had learned through my career in accountancy, in project management, in business analysis, a certain way to navigate the world through control and like learning more, doing more, forcing, pushing harder, and the strategies that had got me to where I was financially, I was making no money. And I was so frightened. And I had 30,000 emails unanswered. I had a pile of letters unopened. I had my phone permanently on mute because I was a frightened of the tax department. And I didn't. Didn't know how to get out of my problem. I couldn't see the problem because I was in the problem. I was the problem. And I reached out for a coach and it wasn't my first coach, I've done this before, but. And I reached out and she got me to stop all the doing and start being, stop all of the controlling and start trusting and to go sit on a hill and do absolutely nothing at all and not think or read or listen to podcasts or ebooks. And all of a sudden these ideas started coming up for me and all of my can't, because I was living in a world of can't, I can't do this because. And they turned into cans. And she said, you know what lights you up out of all of these possibilities? And I said, I think I will have more of an impact with what I say than with what I do. And then speaking came back into my life. A speaker coach came back into my life. And that was the point that I discovered what on earth was my passion, why was I on the planet? And this me, what I talk about, what I mentioned, you know, other things, this is why I'm here. And I know this, and being certain about it has made all the difference. And I've just run with this for the last four years and grown and done my NLP stuff and, and been like neck deep in emotions and emotional regulation and nervous system regulation. And this is, you know, like 60, 60 something years of living life one way and now all of a sudden, who knew? Who knew there was this other way to live life? Oh my God. I know it. It's actually Joanne Lockwood: incredible once you, you realise that this other life has been sitting there all along and it was yours for the taking, but you were being held back by limiting beliefs, fear, whatever it may be. I had no idea. No Bobbi Barrington: idea. And there are other lives other than this. You know, they're like. It's a journey of exploration. Every day is a new edge, a new growth, a new. I contemplate a lot. I contemplate a lot. Like, I don't know if any of you listeners know human design, but I have a gate which is called Gate 34, which is the gate of power. The shadow of that gate is forcing. The gift is strength and the city is majesty. And these are beautiful words. And there's an access point for me to contemplate. What am I forcing? Where am I forcing my life to be the way that I think it should be? What could it be like if I let go of that need for it to be a certain way and just trust that it will be perfect? You know, this, this, you know, like. So I'm always contemplating these aspects of me and how I. I went into TK Maxx. You have TK Maxx over, over there as well? Yeah, we have TK Joanne Lockwood: Maxx. Yeah. And I went in there yesterday. My friend said, you know, she really Bobbi Barrington: loves TK Maxx. And I went in there and I thought, this is a bit trashy. Not my kind of store at all. You know, this is not. I Joanne Lockwood: hate it personally, but yeah. This is not, in your Bobbi Barrington: vernacular, Harvey Nicks. Joanne Lockwood: No, it's just rifled rails of disorganised chaos. You know, it's too unstructured for me. I want. I want neatness and tidiness, but every time I go in there, it's like. It's like a swarm of a locust of sort of attack around. Everything's everywhere. Yeah, it's like I can't deal with it. I want nice colour coded stuff. Yes, this is exactly Bobbi Barrington: my point because I went in there too and I thought garish lighting, clothes on racks, you know, like trashy stuff in the shelves. And she Said, what did you think? And, and she said, what? TK Maxx is, is a place for, you know, like main brands, you know. To, you know, you end of Joanne Lockwood: line returns type stuff, isn't it? Yeah, you can get the good stuff at Bobbi Barrington: less than the good stuff price sort of thing like that. And yet my filter, I didn't see that because my filter didn't let me because it was seeing the garishness, the unstructuredness, not the colour codedness, the garish light stuff. And I had allowed, and I had allowed those that worldview of yeah, I'm a classy chick, I like a classy chick shop, you know, I'll shop at Chanel, you know, I'll shop at Harrods or whatever, you know, and maybe not Harrods, Selfridges, I love Selfridges, you know, but, but, but like, like these are beliefs about our world that are not truths. And just like this mirror about how can I see this in a different way with different lens? And I do this all the time, all the time, you know, like, oh my God, how do I think that does that serve me to not see, you know, the deal that's on offer because my filter prevents me from actually seeing it at all, you know, does that make sense? Probably just Joanne Lockwood: the way your brain's tuned. Your brain likes whilst it can live in chaos, it doesn't want chaos all the time. It needs a bit of order and structure. Well that's true, that's true. But Bobbi Barrington: that's my unconscious mind and it's not a truth. I can. Together she and I, we can create a different worldview. We can, you know, as soon as there's any kind of change, needs awareness first. So that mirror, that awareness of how I'm. Then I can question it, then I can change it or not. And unhappy. But every friggin aspect of my life, there's a question mark around it and it's a really. I said, you know, I love it and I hate it at the same time actually. I love it because I love the growth. I love that it stretches me to become a different person. I love this, this adventure, you know, like I've, I've travelled the world but the most exciting adventure I'm finding is in my head. Let me ask you a two Joanne Lockwood: part question. What surprised you that has become surprised that is really difficult about A being a woman and B you being a trans woman. So a woman first. What surprised you that is more difficult as a woman and what makes it doubly difficult being trans? I Don't think Bobbi Barrington: I find anything more difficult as a woman. And I say that because I don't live or work in an environment where there is a gender bias, you know, so I work for myself. I don't even find it when I. When I speak with people. I've hardly had experiences of bias. Like, I went to. Things like, weird things happen. Like, I went to buy a. I had a bodyboard, you know, and it needed a new string on it. And I went into the shop and it had this plug thing and it was too long and needed to be cut off. And the lady said, you know, have you got someone at home who can do that for you? You know, And I'm. And I. And that surprises me, like, to have that kind of feedback, you know, like. Or even where. Where I'm living here, there's a garage and it's got these wooden frames and I can see they've just got, like, screws into the walls and I can easily whip them out. And the lady showing me said, you know, you don't have to do that. You know, get someone else to do that. You know, like. And I've. And I've always done stuff like that. I'm very handy and I'm still handy and. But people don't expect me to be handy, you know, so it's not a challenge. It's just. Or even carrying heavy stuff, you know, a gas bottle or a car battery or something like that, you know, like. And people will offer to cover, carry it for me. And this has not been my experience and I would always have done that. And I say, fine, no problem, you know, and I like to receive that gift, like, to allow them to give that gift as well. And I feel it would be churlish for me to, you know, stomp my little feet and say, I can do it, I can open my own door, whatever. I love also that, you know, like, so I'm 66 and I look like I'm 47. People say, and I'm. Until they see my behaviour and they think I'm 20. But no, I love. I dress. And so I go to a nightclub and I have the expectation of a person who has been socialised to expect to be let in with the Persona and visually of a chick in a little black dress. And I feel like I have this transcendent gender. I can kind of navigate both of these things. Such a buzz in that sense. But your other question, what you're saying. Yeah, so what you're saying there. I've Joanne Lockwood: noticed that myself where you people want to help you more. And also I sometimes lean into it deliberately thinking, well, okay, you offer me help. You want to do that? I'll go, oh, would you? Oh, that's lovely. Thank you. I've been on the London Underground with my bag. I run a lot of training courses in London, making this massive, great big bag, weighs about seven or eight kilos. It's really heavy up and down the stairs in the Underground. I've had people come up to me and say, let me take that for you. I go, okay, thank you. I get to the top. And I said, really, really appreciate that. Thank you. I've had people carry a case up the stairs at the Union Jack Club where we met in London. That's quite steep stairs. Yeah. I lean into it. Now, I don't see as a sign of weakness. I see it as a sign of. Actually, I'm 60 years old myself. I'm no spring chicken. So if a young, fit person wants to carry my bag, as an older person, that's fine, and as a woman, that's fine as well. And to be able to receive that Bobbi Barrington: is not as common as we might think. You know, like, when, like, compliments. I have never had anything like, as many compliments in my life as I have had as a woman. It's just like I walk out the door and people say, I love your hair. I love your dress. I love, you know, something like that. Never as a man would I have had that kind of thing. 90% of those compliments are from women, women to women. And this is. This is a joy. One of my speeches that I've not written yet, but I will, is about the hidden. The hidden freedoms of being a woman. The freedoms that you don't know that you have because you're in it. You can't see it. And that is one of the freedoms. Freedom to be able to not have to do it all, not have to know all the answers, you know, to be able to. To be allowed to let someone do something for you. You know, hold a door, carry your car battery or your gas bottle or open the car door. You know, these are. There's also other freedoms like the freedom to touch without necessarily meaning anything, and the freedom to walk down the street without people crossing to the other side because. Because you're scary, you know, so the freedom to be a safe person, to be around. I love these freedoms, but they are not, by and large, visible to people. The freedom to be emotional, to cry. These. I think these are important, important freedoms, and they should not just be freedoms of women. They should be freedoms for everybody. But you asked me, Joanne, about the second part to that question was what bits are harder? And this is something that's really come up for me lately. And I put a post out about this, you know, a few weeks ago that you may have seen on Facebook. And it's about, it's about always having that little question in my head, that little doubt about, about that worthiness, you know, because, because I so want to be what I can't be. I so can't be a CIS woman. I so can't have that same kind of anatomy and, and I wish I did. I think it's a, a lot to do with anatomy, actually. But also, I don't have 60 years of lived experience of, of living as a woman. You know, the ups and downs of it, you know, the highs and lows, you know, like, I just haven't, you know, I, I obviously never had the opportunity to have, have a child of my own or breastfeed or any of those things. They are not the thing so much. But right now it's self acceptance. I went to the doctor the other day and I had to have a blood test and I had a prostate test. And she questioned, how come you're having a prostate test, you're a woman? And I said, actually, I'm a trans woman. And I kind of resent having to say that. I kind of resent having to out myself and explain myself and, you know, the fingerprints of my life that still sit over me and it's, and I find it embarrassing, you know, when I have to go, go there and I still have to go there from time to time and I, and I don't like it, you know, and I'm really fortunate that I can be in women's spaces naked in a room full of like a temple of women. And I'm a, and I'm a chick and you can't tell with me. And I am so delighted by that that they're still this little question in my head, you know, am I fully accepted? Am I Joanne Lockwood: good enough? Do I pass the test? What do people think of me? Yeah, the imposter syndrome. When am I going to get discovered and cast out? Yeah, and it's never happened, you know, all Bobbi Barrington: of the evidence, the evidence has been quite the opposite. The evidence has been of beautiful acceptance. Beautiful. Like the women in my world, they know that I'm trans and I swear that they forget most of the time, you know, and, you know, when I, when I talk about My ex, you know, people say, oh, like your husband, you know, and it's just like she's a chick, ex's, her husband, you know, and they, and they, and it's like so affirming it. And even my voice, you know, like I listen to my voice as a recording and I feel I hear my old gender in it. Other people never, never say anything about that. Even when I talk on the phone, they know there's a woman on the phone. So it's me. It's nothing to do with anyone outside of me. It's all, all internal. It's all me and my self belief. Joanne Lockwood: Yeah, I definitely went through phases over the last 10, 11, 12 years since I transitioned, where you're judging yourself more critically than anybody else would ever, I think. And I don't know when or exactly the timescale what happened was one day I was just, maybe I stepped over a line and I stopped caring or stopped being hyper aware or stopped worrying about what I look like, what I sound like, whatever. So I realised that everybody's looking at everybody and everyone's judging each other. And most people actually care more about themselves than they do about anybody else. Once you realise that nobody really gives a damn about you that much, you just go, okay, I just get up, get on with my life and it's okay. And that gives you a bit of freedom as well. When you find that hopefully one day you'll have that epiphany where you go, hey, I haven't thought about that phrase. It's good. Yeah. Like, this issue Bobbi Barrington: is by no means exclusive to trans people or us. Like, so many women have body shame, so many women can't look in the mirror. So many women and men, you know, men have this as well, you know, like it's a human thing and it just happens to be my journey. But that, that was your question about, you know, what are the bits that I felt a little bit and, and it's, it's getting better and better and I work on it and I reframe and you know, one of the things I say is tell a better storey. Like the realities that we create through the beliefs that we have and the storeys that we tell ourselves, we got the pen in our hands. We get to write the storeys of our lives. You know, tomorrow is not preordained. Nothing is preordained. We get to write the damn thing, tell a better storey. Joanne Lockwood: It's a fresh piece of toilet paper that we can wipe with or flush it or put on the shelf. Yeah. So just the truth. We can rewrite whatever we want for the future. Yeah, don't get Bobbi Barrington: me started. Don't get me started on toilet paper. I use like four times as much as I ever used to. Yeah, tell me about it. Tell Joanne Lockwood: me about it. Yeah, I could go days without using toilet paper. Now it's like six sheets every six sheets every two hours. It's like. Yeah. And tissues. I never used to use tissues. I used to have hankies. Now I've got tissues in every pocket. Every time I go do a put the washing load on, I have to empty the pockets out of tissues. And it's like. Well, you end up with like, oh, God, I've been tissued. It's sort of full up machine again. It Bobbi Barrington: really is a joy and I am so delighted because, you know, if I hadn't taken this path, then I might not well be here, you know, because I was so sad about stuff, but. And I haven't seen my children for six years. You know, they don't talk to me anymore. And, you know, but you know, like, I have never been happier. I'm having fun. And yeah, it's sad Joanne Lockwood: that you have to make a choice sometimes between your family, friends or life. Yeah. Your social capital, you almost have to trade that in. It's like, it's about playing Texas holding poker. You've got to put all your. You got to go all in on your chips and. But I would sacrifice everything to get what you want. But I would rather Bobbi Barrington: send a message of making a choice to be authentic and happy rather than stay in a relationship that was loveless and didn't, you know, like, was miserable. I would want them to do that every, you know, like every day of the week. My children, I would, I would rather they learn to walk away from something that didn't fulfil them and make better choices for their lives. One life. We get one life, one time on this planet. One shot at joy and happiness and love. And then it's gone. So I can live it. I heard someone say, someone says recently, you know, Joanne Lockwood: people often say, you have one life, you've got to live it. So you only live once. You've got to live it. And someone turned around, said, no, you actually only die once. You live every day. So that's what we should be doing. You only live once, though. We live every day. Go out there and as you say, it's a blank sheet of paper. You can make your life whatever age you are. Bobbi Barrington: I don't think I was living every day. I think I was dying every day, you know, for a long time. And now I'm not. How do Joanne Lockwood: people get. How do people get a hold of you, then? What's the best way of keep tracking you down? So I'm Bobbi Bobbi Barrington: Barrington, and that's B O B B I, Bobbi Barrington. And I like Bobbi. I think it's a great name. Joanne Lockwood: I think Bobbi's cute. So on. On LinkedIn, we've got a website. LinkedIn is Bobbi Barrington. On Bobbi Barrington: Instagram is Bobbi Barrington. And my website is bobbybarrington.com and I wish someone nicked Bobbi Barrington on Facebook, which is most unkind, but it's BobbiGirl1, which. Which I have there. But I'm sure if you search for Bobbi Barrington, you'll find me, you know, and flick me the message and I'll get that how to feel alive again thing over to you. I was just looking Joanne Lockwood: at the. The show notes. Just pick out a couple of quotes in there. You said, I don't want anyone else to live a life that isn't truly theirs. And then my why is simple. Because nobody should have to live a life that isn't their truth. That's very powerful. Bobbi Barrington: But we do. We do, because that life is familiar, that life feels safe. That life we've created to protect ourselves, and it serves. And even though we might hate it, we are addicted to it and we love it. And this is what the coaching is about. It's helping bridge a life from where someone is to where they want to go. And holding their hands through those steps. You can't see the steps. You don't know the way. You can't see what you can't see. But this is me. I hold your hand, I walk with you, and we do epic shit together. Boom. And Joanne Lockwood: on that note, Bobbi, it's been absolutely fantastic having a chat with you for. I love these podcasts because it means I get to have a chat with some fantastic people, you included. And we spent an hour and a half together just yakking away, and it's been amazing. Thank you so much. And if you're listening, I'm sure you'll take something away from this. So, Bobbi, thank you. Thanks, Joanne. Thank you for doing what you do. As we bring this conversation to a close, I want to express my deepest gratitude to you, our listener, for lending your ear and heart to the cause of inclusion. Today's discussion struck a chord. Consider subscribing to Inclusion Bites and become part of our ever growing community, driving real change. Share this journey with friends, family and colleagues. Let's amplify the voices that matter. Got thoughts, storeys or a vision to share? I'm all ears. Reach out to jo.lockwood@seechangehappen.co.uk and let's make you your voice heard. Until next time, this is Joanne Lockwood signing off with a promise to return with more enriching narratives that challenge, inspire and unite us all. Here's to fostering a more inclusive world one episode at a time. Catch you on the next bite.